a comment on JOLLYBLOGGER: Is Satan Bound?
18th August 2005
Below is a comment I composed for the above blog entry. I decided to use a trackback instead of posting a mile long comment on David’s blog. Please disregard the references to making a blog entry here as I just cut and paste and didn’t bother revising to remove those references. 
When I get time I will try to make a blog entry on the subject but let me respond to what was directed at me.
First off, let me state that my comments are never meant to be malicious (this is directed to David Wayne). In fact, I read your blog regularly and link to it from my blog. Now, I stand by my statement that saying Satan is bound right now in some sort of figurative/metaphysical way is a stretch to say the least. In addition, I am perplexed that you stated I am “way off base”, after all we are discussing eschatoloty. How am I way off base here? I definitely must have missed something if the amillennial position has somehow become the strongest eschatological view Scripturally.
Now on to the things mentioned because I am still not seeing it.
Matthew 12:25-29 ISV He knew what they were thinking and said to them, “Every kingdom divided against itself is destroyed, and every city or household divided against itself will not stand. (26) So if Satan drives out Satan, he is divided against himself. How, then, can his kingdom stand? (27) If I drive out demons by Beelzebul, by whom do your own followers drive them out? That is why they will be your judges! (28) But if I drive out demons by the Spirit of God, then the kingdom of God has come to you. (29) How can someone go into a strong man’s house and carry off his possessions without first tying up the strong man? Then he can ransack his house.
Where is this saying that Satan is bound? In context, I don’t see the binding of Satan even remotely relating to the above Scripture.
John 12:31-33 ISV Now is the time for the judgment of this world to begin. Now will the ruler of this world be thrown out. (32) As for me, if I am lifted up from the earth, I will draw all people to myself.” (33) He said this to indicate the kind of death he was about to die.
I suppose I can see where someone could try to use this verse to say Satan is no longer in the world. However, we have plenty of Scripture contrary to that, written after this particular book (i.e. 1 John 5:19). We must interpret Scripture by Scripture.
Colossians 2:13-17 ISV Even when you were dead because of your offenses and the uncircumcision of your flesh, God made you alive with him when he forgave us all of our offenses, (14) having erased the charges that were brought against us with their decrees that were hostile to us. He took those charges away when he nailed them to the cross. (15) And when he had disarmed the rulers and the authorities, he made a public spectacle of them, triumphing over them in the cross. (16) Therefore, let no one judge you in matters of food and drink or with respect to a festival, a new moon, or a Sabbath day. (17) These are a shadow of the things to come, but the reality belongs to Christ.
Once again, I am not seeing a specific reference here to Satan being bound. Even if Satan was “disarmed”, that is not the same as being bound, thrown into the bottomless pit, and sealed up.
Hebrews 2:14 ISV Therefore, since the children have flesh and blood, he himself also shared the same things, so that by his death he might destroy the one who has the power of death (that is, the devil)
1 John 3:8 ISV The person who practices sin belongs to the evil one, because the devil has been sinning since the beginning. The reason that the Son of God was revealed was to destroy the works of the devil.Are you really trying to use these two verses to say that Satan has already been destroyed? Read a few chapters further into 1 John and you will see…
1 John 5:19 ISV We know that we are from God and that the whole world lies under the control of the evil one.
In addition, if Satan was already destroyed why would he need to be destroyed again later on in Revelation?
So, I by no means think I am “way off base” on my statement that taking a position that Satan has been tied up, thrown into the abyss (locked up and sealed) is a “stretch”.
This is only a short response…even so, I feel it may be too long for a comment so I apologize. When I get some time perhaps I will make a blog entry on the subject matter.
Oh, and BTW, I am not stating that I am firmly grounded in my eschatological view, however, I like to have strong Scriptural support when taking certain positions on issues/doctrine and the amillennial view of eschatology doesn’t fall into that category (I am not sure any of the views do, hence such debate on the subject). I liked some of the comments David and BlackCalvinist made on the subject in a previous post.
AMDG
August 20th, 2005 at 23:39
AMDG:
I just started reading your entry, and although I am new to Blogging, I am very interested in your thoughts. 1 John 3:8 states that the son of God was revealed to DESTROY THE WORKS OF THE DEVIL. I believe the Word destroy in the original Greek means to completely annihilate, to obliterate from existence. I believe that in the finished work of the Cross, that satan was completely disarmed,judged and defeated. The domain of darkness, as the book of Colossians describes his authority, was placed in subject to the Kingdom of God which was initiated by Jesus Christ.
The way I picture this defeat, is exactly the way I see the early Hebrew people who were wondering in the wilderness. In Exodus, the Lord told Moses that he had given the Hebrew people victory over the other people groups they were to encounter in the promised land. My question is, when did that victory take place? was the actual victory demonstrated when the Hebrew people actually walked into the promised land and defeated them physically? Or did the actual defeat occur when the Lord spoke it into existence way back in the early portions of Exodus? The Hebrews were to actually demonstrate and manifest the victory in the physical world. They by faith, acted upon the words spoken to their leader Moses, and by faith demonstrated - what God had already spoken.
In the same way the church, needs to manifest The Authority of the Kingdom of God over the domain of darkness. The church becomes the vehicle in which God expresses his authority. Satan is defeated. He has been judged. Although he is still walking around on the earth roaring as a lion. The only battles or victories Satan has won are in the areas where the church is not engaged him in.
I am not talking about political authority of spiritual authority which is manifested for servanthood. it is a spiritual authority demonstrated by loving your neighbor as yourself. By seeking the Lord God with all your heart, soul, mind, and body.
On a Side Note, I Must Say I Believe the Left behind Series, in which the initial book was authored by Tim LaHaye, has promoted one of the greatest philosophical deceptions active in the church today. It’s an eschatology of defeat. It tells the church to wait to fly out of here by the rapture and not the active in the marketplace of life. Have You Ever Read any of the writings of Clarence Larkin? he was the initial author of the timelines that many pre-trib writers used to interpret the events occurring in the world. If you ever have the chance to get this book, opened up to the middle pages, you’ll find a graph entitled, “The Failure of Christianity.”
The initial rapture theory, which has almost become dogma today, was produced and developed with the thought in mind that Christianity was to fail. It was initially developed due to the fact that paganism was rising at such a rapid rate in the early 1900s that based on projected growth of that religion, Christianity would have been totally eradicated from the Earth by the year 2000. So Larkin decided to propose a rapture theory that in essence states, that the Church of Christ was to fail and to prevent it from being completely overrun and destroyed by paganism, God was to rapture out the faithful but small remnant from the earth. It is that idea which is so pervasive in today’s church culture, that has defeated the Christian expression in the public sphere or marketplace today.
MJPMD
August 21st, 2005 at 00:14
Welcome to the wonderful world of blogging.
Allow me to post some translation notes from the NET Bible on the verse in question.
(1 John 3:8 NET) The one who practices sin is of the devil,(27) because the devil has been sinning(28) from the beginning. For this purpose(29) the Son of God was revealed: to destroy(30) the works of the devil.
27 sn The person who practices sin is of the devil. 1 John 3:10 and John 8:44 might be cited as parallels, because these speak of opponents as the devil’s “children.” However, it is significant that the author of 1 John never speaks of the opponents as “fathered by the devil” in the same sense as Christians are “fathered by God” (1 John 3:9). A concept of evildoers as “fathered” by the devil in the same sense as Christians are fathered by God would imply a much more fully developed Gnosticism with its dualistic approach to humanity. The author of 1 John carefully avoids saying that the opponents are “fathered by the devil,” because in Johannine theology not to be fathered by God is to be fathered only by the flesh ( John 1:13). This is a significant piece of evidence that 1 John predates the more fully developed Gnosticism of the 2nd century. What the author does say is that the opponents (”the one who practices sin”) are from the devil, in the sense that they belong to him and have given him their allegiance.
28 tn The present tense verb has been translated as an extending-from-past present (a present of past action still in progress). See ExSyn 520.
29 tn Here εἰς τοῦτο (eis touto) states the purpose for the revelation of God’s Son. However, the phrase offers the same difficulty as all the ἐν τούτῳ (en toutō) phrases in 1 John: Does it refer to what precedes or to what follows? By analogy with the ἐν τούτῳ construction it is probable that the phrase εἰς τοῦτο here refers to what follows: There is a ἵνα (hina) clause following which appears to be related to the εἰς τοῦτο, and in fact is resumptive (that is, it restates the idea of “purpose” already expressed by the εἰς τοῦτο). Thus the meaning is: “For this purpose the Son of God was revealed: to destroy the works of the devil.”
30 tn In the Gospel of John λύσῃ (lusē) is used both literally and figuratively. In John 1:27 it refers to a literal loosing of one’s sandal-thong, and in John 2:19 to a destruction of Jesus’ physical body which was understood by the hearers to refer to physical destruction of the Jerusalem temple. In John 5:18 it refers to the breaking of the Sabbath, in John 7:23 to the breaking of the law of Moses, and in John 10:35 to the breaking of the scriptures. The verb is again used literally in John 11:44 at the resurrection of Lazarus when Jesus commands that he be released from the graveclothes with which he was bound. Here in 1 John 3:8 the verb means, with reference to “the works of the devil,” to “destroy, bring to an end, abolish.” See BDAG 607 s.λύω 4 and F. Bëchsel, TDNT 4:336.
The above notes help shed a little light on that verse. However, what say you on verses that follow? If this verse meant Satan was destroyed, how then can he continue to be in control of the world?
(1 John 5:19 ISV) We know that we are from God and that the whole world lies under the control of the evil one.
AMDG
August 21st, 2005 at 00:41
DESTROY: 4. luo (λύω, 3089), “to loosen,” especially by way of deliverance, sometimes has the meaning of “breaking, destructively,” e.g., of “breaking” commandments, not only infringing them, but loosing the force of them, rendering them not binding, Matt. 5:19; John 5:18; of “breaking” the Law of Moses, John 7:23; Scripture, John 10:35; of the “breaking up” of a ship, Acts 27:41; of the “breaking down” of the middle wall of partition, Eph. 2:14; of the marriage tie, 1 Cor. 7:27.
Vine, W. E., Unger, M. F., & White, W. 1996. Vine’s complete expository dictionary of Old and New Testament words . T. Nelson: Nashville
I have never felt that Satan was destroyed from the earth. But that his works or his ability to accomplish and produce the fruit of his domain of darkness, has been destroyed by the finished work of Christ in Calvary. I think that has profound implications for the mission of the church. Too often the church is preoccupied with a theology that releases them from responsibility to societal injustices. Although it may appear that Satan is in control of this world, his authority has been defeated by the Cross. Again, when did the Hebrew people experience the victory over their enemies?
Was the victory over their enemies at the time of execution of God’s decree or did the victory take place over their enemies at the time of His decree? I believe the answer to that question has profound impact upon the role in mission of the church As It Pertains to the Kingdom of God.
mjpmd
August 21st, 2005 at 14:59
Well first off let me state that you make some good points in relation to the church.
However, I do not think Satan has been destroyed. In fact, I think the Scripture in question (1 John 3:8) where Christ came to destory the works of Satan is referring to the fall of man in the beginning (Adam and spiritual death). Christ destroyed that “death” so that we may be born again and have life in Him. In addition, I still think Satan roams the earth and steals, kills, and destroys just as he always has. I know that we are children of God and that the whole world is under the control of Satan (it is his domain).
( John 10:10 NET.) The thief comes only to steal and kill and destroy; I have come so that they may have life, and may have it abundantly.
(1 John 5:19 NET.) We know that we are from God, and the whole world lies in the power of the evil one.
What I have not seen in the Scripture is the destruction of Satan and/or his deeds. On the contrary, it is apparent in the Scripture that Satan’s works in general are still something we battle against.
( Ephesians 6:12 NET.) For our struggle is not against flesh and blood, but against the rulers, against the powers, against the world rulers of this darkness, against the spiritual forces of evil in the heavens.
( Ephesians 6:16 NET.) and in all of this, by taking up the shield of faith with which you can extinguish all the flaming arrows of the evil one.
That being said, I must say that I think Satan is a “non-issue”. What I mean by that is, God is Sovereign over everything. In addition, God is not “hands off” in His creation, He is active in all things. So if a Christian were to ask me if we should fear Satan and his works or deeds. I would answer with a resounding no. My belief in the Sovereignty of God Almighty shapes my worldview, not a belief that Satan is someone that should be feared.
That is my take on it…but trying to be as faithful to the Scripture as possible, I cannot say that Satan, his works, or his deeds have been bound or destroyed.
Satan has definitely not been bound, thrown into and sealed in the abyss (that was point of the original post).
AMDG
August 23rd, 2005 at 23:07
I am just interested in dialoguing on how your view of Satan affects the function and expression of the New Testament church in culture today. 1 Peter 5:8 states, ” be of sober spirit, be on the alert. Your adversary the devil, prowls about like a roaring lion, seeking someone to devour.” So I would agree with you, Satan is walking the earth sinking someone to devour. This would imply that he is capable and desires to find those who are ignorant to his themes to devour them.
2666 καταπίνω [katapino /kat·ap·ee·no/] v. From 2596 and 4095; TDNT 6:158; TDNTA 841; GK 2927; Seven occurrences; AV translates as “swallow” four times, “swallow” once, “drown” once, and “devour” once. 1 to drink down, swallow down. 2 to devour. 3 to swallow up, destroy.
Therefore, it is my assumption, that Satan is no longer Gods at the adversary - he is our adversary. As Colossians 2 states- “and when you were dead in your transgressions and not on circumcision of your flesh. He made you alive together with Him, having forgiven us all are transgressions, having canceled out the certificate of debt consisting of the decrees against us in which was hostile to us; and He has taken in out-of-the-way, having nailed it to the cross. He had disarmed the rulers and authorities, He made a public display of them, having triumphed over them through Him.” Satan has been described as the accuser of the breathren in front of the throne of God. But Christ through the cross canceled out the certificate of debt which consisted of the decrees against us. So although Satan has the power to deceive people so that he might destroy them, the finished work of Christ upon the cross destroyed his authority and not his activity. Again I assert this has profound implications of how you view the New Testament church. Yes Satan is active in the world today, his authority over the believer has been destroyed. I believe that is why Christ in the Great Commission stated, “all authority has been given to me in heaven and earth. Go therefore and make the cycles of all nations…” isn’t that what a Christ says in Matthew,” or else how can one enter into destroy man’s house, and spoil his goods, except tea for spotting the strongman? And then he will spoil his house.”
The church things to consider two major perspectives in defining its function in transforming culture. These perspectives are at the crux of either limiting were advancing the kingdom of God. Those perspectives being the redemptive work of Christ and its relationship to the activity of Satan. Were more simply put, the kingdom of God versus the domain of darkness. You either see the kingdom active in the world today where Christ rulership is being displayed and demonstrated through the gifting of individual believers in the marketplace of life or you see the church hopelessly lost wondering when the rapture is going to occur to rescue them from the onslaught of evil activity.
It is at least my perspective, in defining these two issues, to see the Kingdom of God victorious over the activity of Satan. I want to see the church built at the gates of hell to rescue those who are being devoured by Satan’s activity. The cross defeated Satan - he is no longer gods at adversary. He is an adversary only to the church. The church must awaken from its slumber and recognize its royal heritage - to be the carrier of God’s presence into all the world. Where His presence is, His rule reigns.
August 23rd, 2005 at 23:49
Well, I think that Satan does as he pleases in the world (those that aren’t Christians). I think God has allowed him this.
In addition, I do not think that Satan can do anything to a Christian that isn’t cleared through God (i.e. Job). I know I am going to catch some flack on that one.
As I said in a previous post, I think Satan is a “non-issue”. My focus is on Christ and His Sovereignty. In fact, I think the picture of Satan as an adversary to God is a picture for our temporal benefit only. Satan and all of his actions do not truly thwart our Sovereign Lord.
The only way I see Satan as our adversary is in evangelism…as he has no real power over us (Christians). Pretty much all he can do to us is tempt up, whereas, he can do a lot more than that to someone who is not born again.
As far how my view affects church function and expression…
I am not real sure. I don’t think the church or any Christian should fear Satan in any form or fashion. I would say this is what the church and every Christian should do:
( Ephesians 6:10-18 ISV) Finally, be strong in the Lord and in his mighty strength. (11) Put on the whole armor of God so that you may be able to stand firm against the devil’s strategies. (12) For our struggle is not against a human opponent, but against rulers, against authorities, against cosmic powers in the darkness around us, against evil spiritual forces in the heavenly realm. (13) For this reason, take up the whole armor of God so that you may be able to take a stand in that evil day. And when you have done everything you could, you will be able to stand firm. (14) Stand firm, therefore, having fastened the belt of truth around your waist, and having put on the breastplate of righteousness, (15) and having put shoes on your feet so that you are ready to proclaim the gospel of peace. (16) In addition to all of these, having taken up the shield of faith, with which you will be able to put out all the flaming arrows of the evil one, (17) also take the helmet of salvation and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God. (18) Pray in the Spirit at all times with every kind of prayer and request there is. For the same reason be alert with every kind of effort and request for all the saints.
I think we are pretty close to being on the same page.
AMDG
August 24th, 2005 at 16:45
I agree
August 25th, 2005 at 13:57
Brian - sorry I’ve taken so long to get over here and comment, and thanks btw for your prayers for me while I was sick.
Also, apologies for the intemperate language.
I’ll be doing a follow up post on this to flesh out a bit more of what I understand “binding” to mean, so I won’t go into it all here except to say that I am advocating that we let Scriptural language govern all of our conversation and views. In other words, if the Scripture says that Satan has been bound, destroyed, defeated, disarmed, etc., our task is not to explain why Satan is not bound, destroyed, ect.. It is to understand exactly how it is that Satan can be said to be bound, defeated, etc., and yet still active. I think our understanding of present day activity needs to be governed by both poles here - his present defeat and his present activity. Now, how the two intersect and intertwine, well that’s the tricky part.
August 25th, 2005 at 16:42
David,
Agreed. I try to hold that same position on on all issues. That is, your statement of “advocating that we let Scriptural language govern all of our conversation and views” in relation to what appears to be two conflicting views.
Another very good example is free-will vs God’s Sovereignty. If we let Scripture govern our views we are left with both. So the complicated part becomes understanding, teaching and explaining how both co-exist (though I actually think it is more just a re-training of human logic/understanding in this particualy case).
I look forward to reading the more detailed post on your blog.
AMDG